PCP (Personal Contract Purchase) is the fastest-growing finance method, with very good reason. But it’s also the most misunderstood. Not any more, thanks to MSL’s deputy Editor Bruce WilsonBuying a motorcycle used to be a relatively simple affair; you either had enough money for one, or you didn’t. But the introduction of finance changed things. For some, finance is a dirty word, but for others it’s an opportunity maker; a tool that gives you the chance to own something you’d never dreamed of. According to Matt Smith of Bikers Motorcycles in Swadlincote, “Around six-out-of-ten of all our new bike are sold using some form of finance.

• Honda Motorcycles
• Negotiating New Motorcycle Purchase Uk Football Tickets
• Negotiating New Motorcycle Purchase Uk Football Tickets

Jul 29, 2005  How to Buy a Motorcycle. There are many things to take into consideration when purchasing a motorcycle. In particular, this how-to is aimed at first-time buyers. After your first purchase, you will become more comfortable with the buying. Like it was said before, some bikes do not have much profit margins so sometimes negotiation is not possible. But bikes, like ANY product supply and demand still applies. So all depends some bikes you can negotiate down a lot, if the bike is being.

Honda Motorcycles

It’s becoming ever more popular. People are becoming more educated on the subject, and less worried about signing up for credit.”.

But, he admitted, there’s still a lot of confusion around contemporary finance methods, which have moved on since the days of getting your dad to guarantee the repaymentsWhat are the buying options?As a buyer you have four main options; cash, hire purchase (HP), a personal loan (PL) or personal contract purchase (PCP). Cash is the simplest method, but it’s also one of the least used nowadays. A personal loan can work well, assuming you can borrow money with a low interest rate over a period that suits you. The HP system means you borrow sufficient money from a finance company to cover the bike’s value, minus the initial deposit; which is a typical requirement in most cases. Four-to-five years is the normal loan agreement period, and like a PL, it depends massively on what deal you can strike as to whether this is an affordable option.Most manufacturers are pretty good at subsidising a loan’s APR interest to help incentivise model sales; Suzuki’s website shows it’s offering a 0% interest offer on select models over a 48 month period, with just a £1 deposit needed. The list price for a new V-Strom 1000 Adventure is £10,135, which would mean monthly repayments of just £211.12.

After four years you can chop it in or keep it for as long as you like. The other option is PCP finance, which has been around in the car industry for a long time, last year accounting for 92% of UK car sales. It’s also become massively popular for bikes over the last few yearsHow does PCP work?Unlike traditional finance (HP), which is made up of two parts – a deposit and monthly repayments – with PCP you split the cost of the bike into three chunks; a deposit, your monthly repayments and the final chunk, which is the future value of your bike (known as the guaranteed minimum future value, or GMFV).

Because you’re only paying back a part of the total cost of the bike, the monthly repayments are way lower than if you were paying the total of the outstanding balance. Some people get hung up on the GMFV or ‘balloon payment’ as it used be known, but they shouldn’t. The figure is created by the finance company to forecast a future value for the bike – not the actual value, but the minimum value.For example, a £10,000 bike could have a deposit of £1700, and if the bike is expected to be worth £6,000 after 3 years the GMFV could be set at around £4300. Therefore when you trade the bike in you have £1700 collateral as your deposit for your next machine.

If the figures have been set correctly by the finance company, you ride into a dealership in three years’ time with the equity carried over and ready to put down on the next bike you choose. Assuming you go for something of a similar tier, it’s likely your monthly payments will remain close to what you’ve been used to, despite coming away with a brand new bike.According to Yamaha UK’s Marketing Manager Jeff Turner, the continuation of PCP on a new motorcycle at the end of a contract’s term is almost inevitable, “PCP has made motorcycles so much more affordable. Our R125 is supported by a PCP deal, requiring a £1000 initial deposit and then monthly payments of £69 for the next three years. Once the period is up our customers can go back into a Yamaha dealership and take out PCP on the R3, carrying over the equity from that initial deposit, with monthly repayments going up by just £10.

It’s a no brainer, and has seen huge popularity amongst our customers. Our PCP is marketed under the ‘MiYamaha’ label and was originally launched by us in 2013, perfectly timed alongside the introduction of the MT-09. The MTs have sold exceedingly well since their introduction, and 50% of the models sold in year one were purchased using PCP. I can only see this finance method becoming more used in the future.”PCP in practiceFor a real appreciation of how PCP works, I got a quote at Marshall BMW, near Grimsby. Sales Manager Paul Clarke sat me down and pulled out a ‘Statements of Demands and Needs Credit’ form. He explained that it’s the dealer’s responsibility to work out the best buying option for each customer. Using a ‘Product Fact Finding’ flowchart, I was asked a variety of questions including how long I intended to keep the bike, what kind of annual mileage I’d typically do, and whether low monthly repayments were important to me.

My answers pushed me towards the PCP route. “We’re regulated for consumer credit activities by the Financial Conduct Authority (FCA)”, said Paul.

“With the onus being placed on us to make sure that any purchase is made with a full appreciation of all the buying options available to a customer. In today’s world everything is very clear for customers, and it’s our intention to help everyone grasp the entireties of finance options. Most of our customers are new to PCP, but over half of our bikes sold are purchased using this platform, because it suits their pocket. It’s not right for everyone, but the biggest hook to PCP is that it makes high-end products affordable, and the monthly repayments are often much less than what you’d be looking at on HP, because you’re not paying off all of the motorcycle’s value.” Paul Clarke, Marshall BMWBasing a PCP quote on an R12000GS TE, priced at £14,355 OTR, with a deposit of £2895.56, the deal I was offered would have meant monthly repayments of £146 per month for the next 35 months, and a 5000 mile annual mileage (you can increase or decrease your predicted mileage to suit, but it will cost you more). At the end of that term I’d be left with the option of paying off the remaining £7732.99 (GMFV), or I could hand the bike back – essentially selling it to a dealer (and not necessarily the one I bought it from), walking away with whatever equity I had left on top of the owed figure. Alternatively, I could trade the bike (and its equity) in against another bike. I tried to get a committed figure from Paul to work out exactly how much money would be mine at the end of the three year term, but he said knowing that precise sum would be very hard to calculate, because likewise I couldn’t guarantee that the bike’s condition would be as good as it should be, or that I hadn’t put 20,000 more miles on the clock than I should have (miles on top of the contracted PCP annual mileage figures leave you open to charges, typically 5-6p per mile).

Of course, other parameters can also impact on a bike’s worth; if the market became swamped with GSs it would reduce their desirability, much the same as if BMW released a new and better GS before my bike was being sold to the dealer. But as you’ll see, it’s still unlikely you’ll lose money on the deal.The motorcycle industry works with two major pricing guides, which forecast a bike’s value. The CAP Green Book is one, Glass’s Guide is the other. I looked up the trade price for a two year old R1200GS TE in the latter (because they’ve not yet been out for three years), it’s shown as worth £10,600.

At a single year old its trade value was £11,555, so you could logically assume that by three years it would have lost two grand more; being valued around £9500. Taking the above into account, this should mean that when my term ended on the three year PCP deal, my GS (assuming it was in good condition and I hadn’t broken the demands of the PCP contract) would actually be worth around £1800 more than the £7732.99 GMFV set out.My maths aside, Paul reassured me that it’s unlikely a bike will be valued at less than the GMFV figure. And, even if it is, it’s not for you to try and find the shortfall to bridge it up to the GMFV sum; that’s a problem for the finance company to have to worry about. In that scenario you’d simply conclude your finance arrangement at the end of the term and walk away with nothing – you’ve lost your equity, but you’ve also nothing more to pay. According to Paul, “The GMFVs are really well thought out, so despite not being able to give an exact figure of how much equity someone will have in a bike when it’s time to hand it back, it’s very rare that any one is left needing to find a substantial amount of additional money for their next motorcycle, because the GMFV figure is always lower than what the bike is actual worth. I recently had a guy come in with a ’13-plate R1200GS, which had a GMFV of £7700. I gave him over £10,000 for his bike, which meant he had more than enough to cover the deposit on his next purchase.”Is PCP always best?There are many reasons to go for PCP, with perhaps the two biggest hooks being that you’re able to ride away with a brand-new bike that you might not have the cash to buy, and being able to pay low monthly sums to own it.

People also seem to like the idea of being able to conclude the contract at any time, which isn’t so easy on a HP financed deal. Likewise, you’re not tied to any brand (because the money you owe is to the finance company, not a manufacturer), plus when it comes time to sell your bike you can shop around to get the best trade-in figure from any number of dealers. You can even look to sell it privately, as long as you inform the buyer that you have finance left to settle, and obviously let the finance company know what you’re doing. This might get you a bit more cash than you’d be offered from a dealership, although a good retailer will typically try and bridge the deposit gap if you’re slightly short on your next purchase, so bear this in mind and try to get the best deal you can – much the same as if you were trading in any bike. Of course, PCP won’t suit everyone, but there’s a good reason for it proving so popular with those that know of it and understand it. The current economy’s generally low APR rates are making deals even more attractive, so if you were looking to go down this route, now’s probably the best time.The customer’s takeMichael Miller, 71, is a PCP customer, having bought his last four bikes this way.

He told us, “I’m a big fan of PCP. I first came to hear of it around seven years ago, whilst I was looking to buy a new R1200RT. I didn’t have the cash to purchase the new Beemer, so I was looking into finance options and PCP was mentioned. I was a little sceptical at first, because it sounded too good to be true, but the system was explained properly and I couldn’t resist.

I traded my old bike in as a deposit and walked out of the showroom with the bike I really wanted, with a payment structure which made things affordable. I’ve had such a positive experience that I’ve continued going back to the buying option every time, only ever once needing to slightly top up my carry-over deposit, and that was because I wanted to change my bike before the term of the contact had expired. My advice to anyone considering PCP would be to make sure you have allowed yourself a high enough annual mileage, and be sure to keep your bike serviced and in good condition. I’ve never incurred a penalty owing to the state of one of my bikes, although I did get a scratched pannier sprayed before it came time to trade one back in. On the whole, I would recommend PCP to everyone. It’s been a huge asset to me.”Another man who has nothing but praise for PCP is Rob Hill. He’s just signed up to his second term, and told us he’d have otherwise not have been able to afford his new bike.

“I’m a big fan of PCP for a number of reasons. There are a lot of perks, including being able to own a bike that I’d otherwise not be able to afford. What people might not realise is that you also have buying power when it comes to purchasing a new bike, much like a cash buyer. On my last purchase I managed to lower the APR on my bike’s credit by 4%, which has made a substantial difference to the overall cost of my finance. My only other advice is not to get lured into paying too little on your monthly repayments. I’ve opted to pay a bit more than I could have, because I don’t want to be found lacking in equity when it comes time to sell this bike and buy the next one.”How the industry thinksMost brands massively welcome and support finance options. Kawasaki is partnered with Blackhorse Finance – the largest lender in the motorcycle industry – and offsets its marketing budget to help make models more affordable to its customers by subsidising a loan’s APR.

“Every manufacturer pushes incentives”, Kawasaki UK’s Sales Manager Craig Watson told us. “You can offer free insurance, a fancy exhaust or servicing over a certain period of time. It all helps, but what we believe at Kawasaki is that it’s most important to firstly make the motorcycle affordable. We want people to be able to find the bike they want, then find the deal which allows them to own it. In today’s world, price point and affordability has never been so crucial; the market is so competitive”.To make things easy, Kawasaki has created a specific finance-focused website –.

“The website is a great tool”, Craig explained. “People can sit at home and work out exactly what it will cost them to buy a bike on HP or PCP. There’s no salesman standing over your shoulder, so it’s a much less pressured scenario. It’s essentially an aggregator site so, having selected the bike you’re interested in, you can choose the kind of finance you’re after, the duration of the agreement and amount of money you’d be looking to put down as your deposit. Press Kalculate and the site instantly tells you all the stuff you need to know. If you like what you see, you print a copy off or forward the link to your local dealer”.Ducati is another very proactive PCP brand, achieving great success with its TriOptions finance. The Italian manufacturer launched its purchasing product three years ago; a third of all sales are bought using credit, and 90% of these are PCP.

Tim Maccabee is the Managing Director of Ducati UK and told us; “The great thing about PCP is how it can make luxury, premium products like ours very affordable. Because our residuals are so strong, it often works out that our models can be as comparably affordable on PCP as lesser-priced rival products. People love this, and it has significantly opened the door to new customers.”The finance company’s viewBlack Horse Finance is the leading motorcycle finance company.

A chat with its Franchise Development Manager, Dave Macey, shed light on some key PCP questions What happens if my bike’s damaged by the end of the PCP term?“It’s the customer’s responsibility to maintain and ensure the good condition of their motorcycle throughout the PCP period. Naturally, if the motorcycle is damaged its value will be compromised, so will not be worth the same as it would have otherwise. Of course, the GMFV figure is typically set around 20% lower than the bike’s actual value, so assuming the damage/condition of the bike is not too severe, you’ll still get more back for it than the GMFV that was set at the beginning of the contract. But it might mean that you’ll have to put more money in than you would have on your next PCP contract, to meet the 15-20% deposit needed on your next machine.”What happens if you exceed your stipulated mileage?“At the beginning of every PCP term the dealer will carefully help you to determine what your annual mileage should be set at for the duration of the finance– ranging from 1-24,000 miles per annum. Off the back of the mileage, your bike’s GMFV will be set out. So if you were to exceed this stipulated mileage it would essentially alter the bike’s future value.

For this reason, financiers set out excess mileage charges. Most have a two-tier charge system, so for example sub-5000 miles on top of your agreed allowance would be charged at 6p per mile, whilst 5000 miles and upwards would be charged at 12p per mile.

Also, you cannot elect to increase your stipulated mileage half way through the contract, so you must keep this in mind. The excess charge will only impact you at the end of the term, so you might be able to alter your riding usage in the final year to ensure you are within your allotted miles.”Can you conclude your PCP contract at any point?“You can request a settlement figure for your PCP purchase at any point in time, so you can essentially end your PCP at any point. There is no penalty for ending the term early, although the settlement figure will obviously be higher than the GMFV figure that has been calculated for the whole duration of your original term. Some people opt to conclude their contracts when a manufacturer brings out a new bike, prompting them to sell their bike in order to purchase the next one on PCP.”Will changing bikes cost me money?“It’s typical that a customer will have around 20% equity following the sale of their bike, having paid off the remaining finance due. PCP deposits average at around 15-20% of the motorcycle’s value, so if you were to choose a follow-up bike of the same value as the one you have just handed back, then you would have sufficient funds for the necessary deposit. If you chose to go for a less expensive product next you would probably have more money than you need for your next purchase. Likewise, if you went for a more expensive bike you would have to find more money to top up the necessary deposit.”Motorcycle Sport & Leisure magazine is the original and best bike mag.

Established in 1962, you can pick up a copy in all good newsagents & supermarkets, or online.

After looking at improving the sales experience from the point of view of the customer and dealer, contributor and ex-dealer Marty Thompson gives his tips for getting the best deal:A recent discussion on Facebook after those two MBW articles from a disgruntled female potential bike purchaser has prompted me to write a little about getting the best deal on a new or used bike purchase from a dealer. The person had complained that she had been ignored and the salesperson was misogynistic. While I cannot confirm nor deny that it was fact, I have seen the exact same behaviour from both female and male bike sale people over the years.

Now, this article is not written to criticise bike sales people, who for the most part I believe get a bad wrap for various reasons. Having been in the industry all my life from humble beginnings, right through to general management and manufacturer and distributor training, I have seen both sides of the coin. So while it can be said that there is a proportion of poorly trained and behaved sales staff, there are also perhaps greater numbers of poorly behaved customers. If you believe the adage that the customer is always right, then you are most likely also someone who potentially may think this gives you the right to be rude to sales staff.

Please, let me assure you, this is not the best way to obtain a fair deal. In fact, when I was at the coal face, those were the people who I always made the most money from. If a salesperson has to deal with an arsehole, then they need to be remunerated accordingly. The most polite customers were always treated fairly and looked after if there was a problem post sale.

Let me assure you, the arseholes were never offered a loan bike or any other favours if a warranty problem occurred. So, to start with, be nice.But, what is a good deal? If you are the sort of person who would go and buy a bike from another dealer that is not local to you for the sake of $50, $100 or even $250, then you may as well stop reading now. You are the sort of person that a salesperson hates. They spend hours and hours of their time with you, give you all the information you need and then, you reward their efforts by buying elsewhere for a pittance. If that’s you, just remember, come warranty claim time, especially if the claim is borderline, you won’t be looked after. That is not to say, that a customer should expect to have to pay full retail price for a bike.

It is after all 2016 and no one buys at full retail price anymore. You expect to be looked after. Given a deal. For the dealer to want to win your business with a fair price for both them and you and with polite and efficient service.So, you have already determined that you want a bike. Plus, you have narrowed it down to a few possibles and maybe even one that really ticks all the boxes for you. Or alternatively, you have been pragmatic and taken a logical approach and arrived at a short list based on needs and maybe even some wants.

Now it is time to take the step towards buying a bike.Before entering or contacting a dealership, ensure you do some research about the potential bikes you are considering. Check out the advertised prices across print and electronic publications and classifieds. This will give you an understanding of what they are being advertised for. Remember though, that an advertised price, will rarely be the final price agreed to by you and the seller.

Be that a private sale, or dealership sale. Let’s assume you have done due diligence and you know what’s available and you know what prices are being advertised.

Then it’s time to go shopping. Marty Thompson shows his racing styleWhile I would love to tell you that dealers make thousands out of each bike they sell, the realities are far from that.

Top line bikes, even the hot sellers often sell with little to no profit in them. That’s not to say that there is no room for negotiation. It just means that based on your research, you will know when a dealer is trying hard to earn your business, as they will have exhausted their available profit margin in an attempt to earn your business. But, expecting a $5000 saving off a new or current model bike is fairy land stuff.

Maybe on a $30,000+ bike which is being run out with some factory bonuses sure. But on most new bikes, the margins are very slim. I know most think this is not the case, but an available margin on a new bike varies from about4-7% of the retail price for most brands. So a $10,000 new bike, may only have a $400-$700 margin.

Sometimes a little more, often a lot less. Bike dealers are not getting rich off selling you a new bike, trust me.

I’ve seen the books! They are attempting to create service, parts, accessory and finance and insurance opportunities. Maybe trading in a good used bike they might make $1000 on after negotiations. But selling bikes isn’t going to make you rich. Believe me, don’t believe me I don’t really care, but having run dealerships, both two and four wheeled ones, I can tell you that the new vehicle sales department loses money almost every single month.

Without the other dealership departments, there would be no dealerships as they would all be broke. Be aware also, that sometimes a factory offer will leave little or often nothing in the deal for the dealer. The hope being that you may finance the bike with them, or perhaps purchase some accessories.

Both of which means they have an opportunity to make a profit. If you have done your research, then it is going to be easy for you to know if it is the bottom line, or the sales guy is holding out for a bit more profit. Once again, knowledge is power when negotiating.Be as honest as you can.

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Sales people have built in bullshit detectors and can smell an answer which doesn’t sit right. If you have done your research, you will know confidently what a good deal is, so there is no need to lie. Be frank and open. Tell the salesperson what you want to buy and that you are there to negotiate the best price.

If satisfied, you are ready to sign. That is not to say that you will buy it from them if they offer you their best price. It’s all about you being satisfied that it is. While on the subject of being truthful, if you have read one of those books that says don’t tell the dealer about your trade in until you have worked out a price on the new bike, forget it. Your used bike is worth what the market place dictates. Sure, you might again be able to negotiate a little more for it, but it is worth what it is worth, no more and no less.

Don’t be silly by looking at similar bikes that are advertised privately with similar kilometres, age and condition to yours, pick the highest priced examples and expect that for yours. You’re just going to end up frustrated and disappointed. A dealer can only sell your bike for what it is worth in the market place.

Perhaps a little more than private as it may come with a warranty and be workshop checked and prepared. Good dealers can spend an average of $800 preparing a used bike for sale. Owners often don’t see the little things that need doing to a bike and of course, because we know our own bike, we think it is the best in the world.

But trust me, even the best looking bikes often need money spent on them. But don’t spring the trade in on them after negotiations. It’s not being truthful and I am pretty confident that if a sales person lied to you in that manner, it would leave a very sour taste in your mouth.The next thing I would highly recommend, is to actually develop a relationship with one dealer. I know that the easiest sales over the years are to those customers who are repeat customers. As a salesperson, you know that if you look after them, they will buy and you have no hesitation giving them a great price as you know if you do, they will buy now. So get to know a dealer.

Buy from them regularly. Accessories, parts, servicing. Then when it comes time to buy a new bike, I bet London to a brick you will be looked after.

I know those dealers which I have developed long term relationships with, always looked after me. A phone call to buy a bike was usually a 5 minute affair, culminating with me giving them a credit card deposit over the phone and going in a few days later to sign the documents. Simple and easy for both parties and I never got ripped off. Again, knowing a good deal from a bad deal was the key. Today, this information is very simple to obtain, just do a few hours internet surfing and you will know what is and what isn’t a great deal.Now, I am well aware that not all dealers have professional sales staff and even within one shop, there can be great sales staff and absolute plonkers who should have got out of the business in 1974. So don’t accept poor behaviour.

Any sales person who is evasive or especially uses that old line when asked for a price, “I can only give you a price if you are buying it now”, just walk away. That crap went out of the car industry in the 1980s. But there are still some relics who persist with this style of approach despite the fact that it just no longer works. A professional sales person will be more than happy to offer you a good price, once they have worked out exactly what you want and when you want it.

Keep your eye out for manufacturer runouts or sales programs where they offer price or add on incentives for bikes sold and delivered by a certain date. Pushing forward your decision may save some additional money in these circumstances. Also, if you need new gear, it is another avenue for negotiations. You may save that $500 that is stopping you from saying yes, by throwing in a new suit, helmet, gloves or boots into the negotiations. Sometimes there is more margin in the accessories, than there is in the bike they are selling.

Finance and insurance can also be another avenue for price concessions which may sway your decision.Whatever you do, try not to let a poor experience from a sales person taint your next interaction with the next sales person. Remain polite and you are far more likely to be looked after than by being rude. Marty Thompson shows his style Marty Thompson’s Bio:In terms of industry experience, I was the National Sales, Sales Manager and Service trainer for Subaru Australia for eight years, as well as Chrysler Jeep Australia/NZ. My last position was Group Training & Development Manager for the Stillwell Motor Group in Melbourne for two years.

Prior to that, I ran Cosway Kawasaki in the mid ’90s and was the new vehicle manager for Ken Morgan Toyota in the early ’90s.1988-92 Bayford of Preston new and used vehicle sales1992-1994 – Ken Morgan Toyota Nunawading Victoria- New Vehicle Manager1994- WFO distributors- Dealer representative1995-1996 Cosway Kawasaki Melbourne- New and used sales, accessories, spare parts.1997-2009- Auto Inspirations- Managing Director- Sales training, Recruitment, Marketing & retail development for the automotive industry. National trainer for Subaru Australia Sales, service and management, Chrysler Jeep Australia/New Zealand, National trainer Inchcape Automotive Retail sales, service & management, National Trainer QBE Insurance automotive division, as well as sales & management training and retail development for hundreds of automotive Dealerships nationally.2009-2011- Group training and retail development manager Stillwell Motor Group Melbourne. I understand but will not believe that the mark up is that low.

I understand that the building cost, phone bill, electric bill, salary’s, greeters, cashiers, etc all add up and that maybe why you want to state that low profit margin after everything. But what they pay vs what the bike sells for is thousands apart (if a dealership did not cover that cost per bike they would be out of business).

The real question is weather a dealership is willing to deal vs just give you the finger and tell you MSRP or get out of the dealership. I worked for a car dealership, They backed out almost all profit for sales to Police Officers, Fire Fighters, members of the clergy etc to the point that the salesman that wrote the deal only got a “mini deal” that paid the salesman $25.00 for writing it up. I am in the market for a new HD Heritage. I am obviously not buying it during a blizzard outside, so the dealership will not be giving it away. I will attempt to negotiate the best deal or I will reluctantly wait until next winter, JUST TO GET THE DEAL I WANT, so hopefully I will get lucky. Hopefully the fact that I am ready to take delivery NOW, if I can get an unbelievable deal might make the deal.

I’ve been looking at touring bikes and what I have found is location of purchase makes a big difference. Our local Honda dealer in Albuquerque will not wiggle of the list price for a 2 year old 2016 “new” Gold Wing that has been decorating his showroom but I can get the same bike in a 2017 model on the east coast for $4700 less. That $4700 makes it worth flying to the East Coast and taking a riding vacation back. He also told me they can only sell bikes to residents of that particular state which is a load of crap. You have to fly there and sign the paperwork at the dealership in person but it can be done for less than the $4700 difference. GREAT ADVICE.

MOST DEALERS I’VE BEEN TO WON’T GIVE YOU THE TIME OF DAY UNLESS YOU ARE GOING TO BUY SOMETHING OR AT LEAST LOOK LIKE YOU ARE LOL. WHICH IS QUITE SAD. I’VE ALSO BEEN LOOKING FOR A NEW BIKE AND AFTER MONTHS AND MONTHS OF LOOKING, I ACTUALLY FOUND IT.

I’M LOOKING TO GET 2014-15 MV AGUSTA BRUTALE. I FOUND 1 FOR $7800 BRAND NEW. ONLY THING IS THAT IT’S COMING FROM CALI. WHICH MEANS THAT SALES TAX AND SHIPPING WONT BE INCLUDED.

I DON’T WANT TO GIVE THEM A LOW BALL OFFER THEN NOT TAKE ME SERIOUSLY. DO YOU THINK I CAN GET THEM TO GO DOWN A BIT? OH, I’M ALSO PLANNING ON PUT DOWN $3K.THANKS!! This article was written like a true salesman. I have a lot of experience negotiating, including walking out of negotiations only to be rang even before I got home with a substantially lower offer that minutes before the manager brought in to the negotiations said couldn’t be done.The reality is that the salesman’s job is to achieve the highest possible price while trying to make the customer think that he got a great deal and walks out happy.

If as a customer you understand that, then you are well on the way to saving money.The only thing I agree with this article is that one should not be rude. Sales people have a job to do. Sometimes that job is a push over and other times is difficult to impossible. Loyalty to dealerships is a sure way to spend more money than you should. Loyalty should not have a price on it. I will be loyal to a dealer if I achieved a real outcome, not because I settled because they wouldn’t be. I will always test a dealer’s price by shopping widely, only then will I be in a position to know.

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And that includes hard nosed (but always polite) negotiating with multiple dealers.There are always reasons why one dealer will offer a lower price than another. If you don’t negotiate with others you will never know how much your loyalty is costing you. Everyone deserves to be treated with respect and politeness if only for self interest (because you catch a lot more flies with honey than vinegar), so it’s very disappointing that so many people on both sides of the counter in retail are rude and insulting.I would like to ask Simon if the customer who bought cheaper down the road gave him a chance to match the lower price? If not then fair enough Simon should feel aggrieved, but if they did then I don’t think Simon should expect the customer to pay more than he has to just because Simon gave him a test ride. I think test rides are a buyer’s right (can you think of a car manufacturer that won’t give buyers a test drive? $100 is several hours – or more – work for most people and the buyer has the right to value his hard earned money and not have to pay for a test ride.There is a dealer in my area that won’t offer test rides (no demo bikes) and doesn’t take trade ins. It makes it very hard to find any reason to prefer them over any other dealer out of my area who will.

I’ve run dealerships and worked at Manufacturer level Pete no name. If so, state your full name and credentials as I have, don’t hide behind an anonymous comment.To clarify my position.Dealing with a difficult customer is par for the course in retail and something staff do on a daily basis. But I was making comment on rude customers.

There is a difference. I never allowed a rude customer to brow beat any of my staff. They were politely shown the front door by me personally and asked not to return. Yet, we always were among the top two or three dealers in sales and customer satisfaction.

I hope this provides a little more information to give clarity to my comment. As for your comment about dealers making good money, you have very obviously never run a dealership. Very well written Marty,My biggest peeve with customers is when they come in, test ride your demo (which is quite a large expense for the dealership to carry) then buy the bike down the road to save $100. I once gave a WR200 to a customer for the weekend to compete in an enduro, complete with fresh tyres, and a jerry can full of pre-mixed fuel because we wanted the correct oil to be used. He loved the bike and bought a WR200. Butbecause the dealer down the road, who didn’t have a demo, was $100 cheaper, he bought it there. And customers wonder why dealers don’t have a demo of every bike in the range.Of course then there are the “I want warranty liars”.

These commonly own PW50, LT50, and similar kid’s bikes. They come into the shop “demanding” warranty because the bike seized on the weekend while little Johnny was riding it. Suspiciously “No it didn’t run out of oil” is almost the first thing they say. Sure enough, when you check the oil tank, it’s full, to the brim. Of course a simple check of the oil pump and the line between the pump and the motor reveals no oil what so ever. Yes, run out of oil.The there was the RGV owner who was a gun rider. He came in telling me his shock was f.

and his bike was handling like a pig after only a month of ownership. As soon as I jumped on it to take it to the workshop, I could feel that he back tyre was so under inflated that it was indeed handling like a pig. A few PSI fixed his “shock” issue.One of the best was a guy who bought a new helmet and crashed a week later, smacking his head on the road. He wanted warranty on the helmet because the fiberglass had fractured where the helmet hit the road. I kid you not.And the list just goes on and on.It would be easy to write a book because people in the bike trade encounter this sort of thing EVERY day, but I prefer to focus on my nice customers.

The ones who are always welcome in the shop and drop in for a coffee and a chat. The ones who always get a loan bike and their bike given that little bit extra care when they come in for a service. The ones who bring in a carton of beer on a Friday afternoon, then hang around after work and have a drink with the staff.

But most importantly, the ones who I still call friends after 20 tears of riding together.Cheers guys, and girls. Yes, those types of people are still out there. But, we still have to treat them all as real buyers until they prove themselves to be liars and dudders. Then they can go buy elsewhere till they run out of dealers they have used up and burnt. They are also the ones who complain the most aren’t they!!!

🙂 🙂 Like you, most of my long term customers are still great friends and we catch up regularly. They are the ones who developed a relationship with the dealership and who we go above and beyond for. The ones we go and open the shop for on a Sunday to get them a part, or do a small repair. The ones who we push the manufacturer hard to approve a warranty claim that might be outside warranty period and the same people who we also have no hesitation in giving a ripper deal to on any new or used bike, parts and accessories.